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Talmud: So a lot of the guys are talking about , I guess, about the Kol Korah that went out, from Lakewood about attending the rally , that said, I think (that people shouldn't go to the rally) because of the agenda of the people involved (in the rally) and not being fully aware of what the agenda is and recommending that Bnei Torah of Lakewood at least that no one go
Rabbi Wein: They don't learn lessons.....there were rallies for Soviet Jewry and then they also said "Don't go". The only reason that the Soviet Jews got out was because there were rallies
I don't understand it, I just don't understand it , it's beyond me
The Jewish people are on the line , They (Hamas) mean Lakewood too
So what in the world is wrong with you?
You don't know what the agenda is?
The agenda is that Jewish people in America are being persecuted
So because you are living in a bubble so you think "nafshe he'zalti?"
I don't know, I don't know who put it out, I don't know who signed it . A lot of is Fake news
You know how many Kol Koras are signed by people who never saw it?
Talmud:Yes, in America, I know that there was a debate to go or not to go. I know that in my shul, the Rav said that if (going to the rally) is going to affect your sedarim you have to think
about going.Rabbi Wein: The gemaarah says that when it is a milchemes mitzva even a Chassan at his Chuppah has to go, everybody goes ....you know if we don't win this there won't be any "sedarim"
Talmud: So I was thinking that now there is no "pirud" in Eretz Yisrael and they are pretty much unified. Whatever division there was everyone is for the common goal . We don't have that in America yet. And I was thinking that this would have been an amazing opportunity.
Rabbi Wein: Absolutely!
Talmud: Despite the fact there was a Reform Rabbi getting up (speaking) or ....
Rabbi Wein: That battle is not with reform anymore, that battle is not with reform anymore, that battle is over ...your fighting the 18th century all over again.... it is obvious that reform is gone!
What difference does it make? American Jewry is gone and now "omdim aleinu" you won't be able to walk the streets in Chicago and New York. You will have to have your sedorim in private.
A lot of is because the Orthodox community has no guts! They know it's wrong but they have no guts because they won't stand up to it. Because of our cancel culture, we are the ones that invented it.
I'm sorry that you told me about it.
Talmud: I'm sorry that I pained the rebbe , I'm sorry that I pained you. Some shuls in Passaic, Rabbi Sacks said that everyone should go, I'm bringing Landers I'm bringing my Kollel, I'm bringing the boys. and it was a little bit of wishy-washy in other areas
I think they said that there were about 300,000 but I suppose it obviously could have been a lot more than that
Rabbi Wein: It should have been more. A Mazel it was 300,000. You have 5 million Jews in America and you only had 300,000? That shows how weak we are! If 50,000 or 70,000 orthodox Jews would have went and Lakewood would have gone then that would be a statement
Part of it is that they (the orthodox) are convinced that the goyim don't mean them, and they will manage to ride it out., They are going to have cholent forever, that is very shortsighted. The lack of perspective of the past and of the future
and all those guys weren't alive at the Holocaust, I was and they don't remember what it looked like in 1946 after the war when a Jew in America couldn't raise his head
They don't remember What Eretz Yisrael did for us!
B"h I'm not "daas Torah"
Talmud: If you don't learn history you are bound to repeat it?
Rabbi wein" You don't have to repeat it, You just don't have a perspective of what is going on
You do things that are counter productive to you and that's how we got into this mess today because Israel didn't ......... they knew there is no hope, they knew Oslo was wrong, but they like to kick the can down then road until you can't anymore ... The middas hadin was pogeiah.
But that sounds silly that a reform rabbi would speak .... I don't know if a reform rabbi spoke or he didnt spewak
Talmud Or She (the rabbi)
Wein: or a Lesbian...I don't care what? That has nothing to do with anything. We are always worried that we have to "recognize them " we don't have to recognize them anymore its been 200 year gone already... What are you talking about?
Reb Yisrael Salanter said when reform started, he said that the Chasam Sofer put them all in Chierim he said that if it was up to me I would have put a Bais Medrash in every reform temple
You are not allowed to talk to them.... so if you are not allowed to talk to then what do you expect from them? The only one who had anything to do with them was the Lubavitcher Rebbe
Talmud: In what way?
Rabbi Wein: Chabad will go into a reform temple. If Lakewood would go into a reform temple they would also have an influence.
This war in Israel has made more Jews.... traditional.. I cannot measure tzidkis but the country became traditional ...there is Shabbos and Yom Tov and Kosher... What do you want?
80% of Americans are eating Neiveilis and treifis and here everything is kosher and here is where its no good (sarcastically) because it's not MY kosher.?..I don't get it I just don't get it
My rabbaim were not like that. I remember my rebbe Rav Mendel Kaplan z"l who certainly was no Zionist so when Ben Gurion came to Chicago in the Stevens Hotel selling Israel Bonds, he went down there to see it and the next day in the shiur he said "you know what I saw? I saw the Bnei Avraham give money " So I come from a different cheder. I cant relate to it.
Talmud: And I come from your cheder so we are in the same boat
Rabbi wein: I'm afraid for my grandchildren and my great grandchildren they will have no awreness. In the 1930's there was no awareness
You ask "How could it happen?"
Everything can happen that is what this war taught us, that everything can happen, they can burn your baby in front of your eyes, everything that is written in Parshas Nitzavim Happened
We learn Chumash but we don't believe in it we don't think that the chumash actually meant it
"veyisam meshugah me'mareh amecha" we don't believe it. ok
25 comments:
https://www.torahanytime.com/#/lectures?a=264315
Skip to 4:55
This is close to divrei kefirah and should not be posted.
Of course the frum know that the Jewish people are on the line. But who made up this idea that a RALLY is the solution??? Just because YOU think so???? So I have to think like you???!!
Excuse me, but their Daas Torah is allowed to disagree with someones mistaken notion that a rally is THE solution.
They rightfully stated that the solution is not rallies or in US assistance to Israel. With Ishmael the only solution is Yishma e-l Ve'ya'anem. The solution is in Hashem alone.
This is what HE (Hashem) is asking, no BEGGING us to come to the realization that there is NO ONE to realy on except for Hashem and his prophecies which so clearly state that if we rely on HIM only - He will come through and save us.
I implore you DIN to assist in this effort to SAVE the Jews by promoting us turning to Hashem!! NO ONE ELSE!!!
Of course aguda blames the war on "Modern Orthodox and Religious Zionists"
see Shafran's article
https://forward.com/opinion/563955/jewish-community-israel-war-hamas/in the Forward:
3:15
Your "farkrumtah" world view is what causes "sinas chinum"
His words are "kefirah?' I beg your pardon, I sincerely believe that what R' Yitzchok Sorotzkin said is absolute "kefirah" How do you like that?
Don't forget that the ones fighting with Korach were the "Moetzes Gedoilei Hador" in that generation. Don't forget that the meraglim were the biggest and most respected "gedoiei Hador" of the generation, Moshe Rabbeinu hand picked them thru Ruach Hakodesh! Gedoilei Hador are the ones who advised those Jews with Visas prior to WW2 to not mahe Aliyah causing the annihilation of thousands, I repeat thousands of their followers.
Rabbi Wein a student of history who lived in the USA as a bochur during WW2 is so far the only one with common sense!
3:15
R Moshe Feinstein went to the rally with the rabbis! You don't know what the hell you are blabbering about
Did they have immodestly dressed ladies as speakers in the previous rallies that the gedolim went to? Did they have large LCD screens so everybody can watch the female speaker's cleavage? Would the gedolei hador in the previous generation have attended or would have approved a rally with gay / lesbian / female rabbis ? Bochorim and Kollel yungerleit are immersed in 100% kedushah and taharah, tell me one gadol hador that holds that they should leave the beis medrash to listen / see and be exposed to ervas davar?
Look at this article from May 2, 1977:
https://www.jta.org/archive/massive-solidarity-sunday-rally-pledges-it-will-not-forget-soviet-jews-in-their-efforts-to-emigrat
ends with "Before the start of today’s demonstration, the Union of Orthodox Rabbis of the United States and Canada said it could not participate nor condone the actions of Soviet Jewry groups. “Regardless of how well their intentions of actions and words might be, we cannot agree to all their methods and speeches, which can, G-d forbid, cause fatal consequences,” the Union said in a statement by its president, Rabbi Moshe Feinstein."
----
Rav Shraga Moshe Kalmanowitz zt'l said over from his father Rav Avrohom Kalmanowitz zt'l, there was a large asifa in Vienna in Elul 5683. There were Jews from every single circle, talmidi chachomim, baalei batim, bochorim, and the Chofetz Chaim was also there. There was an Ezras Nashim there, the women were on the balcony that surrounded four sides of the hall, but there weren't any curtains. There was a disagreement, some held that it was good enough, they are a floor above us, who is going to look up? And others disagreed. They decided they are going to ask the author of the Mishna Berurah, the Chofetz Chaim zt'l. Chofetz Chaim said:
"Here we are gathering to find advice and guidance for the sake of the entire Jewish people, who face so many spiritual and physical challenges. We need to know in advance the general principle that the Almighty promised us in the Torah.
יש כאן דברים ברורים מאוד בפסוק: הקב"ה מתהלך בקרב מחננו רק כאשר לא ייראה בנו היפך הקדושה... ואם חלילה כן ייראה כזאת בנו, אז חלילה ושב מאחריך
When Hashem is with us, we have nothing to fear. As it says in Tehilim 23:
"גם כי אלך בגיא צלמוות לא אירא רע, כי אתה עימדי"
Even when I go in the valley of death, I am not afraid... because You are with me. However, when Hashem's presence isn't with us, chalilah, we are in great danger. Hashem leaves us when there isn't tzinius. As it says in Devarim 23:15: כי ה' אלוקיך מתהלך בקרב מחניך להצילך וכו' והיה מחניך קדוש, ואם ח"ו לא – ושב מאחריך
For Hashem is going in your camp to save you and to deliver your enemies before you. Your camp must be holy, and there should not be seen anything profane, for then the Shechinah will leave you.
The Chofetz Chaim said that it is for our benefit to be machmir in matters of kedushah and tzinius, if they upgrade the level of tzinius, that will grant a greater manifestation of Hashem's presence, and together with it, a higher level of protection and siyata dishmaya.
---
But here, we think we are smarter than the gedolei hador, and we are kofrim, as we don't believe that hashem is controlling everything. So hashem needs us to expose ourselves to all the tumah, and the issur doraisah of joining in with the reform Jews in the name of "Achdus", and believe that the rally is our means to our salvation.
Who said it's a solution ? Nobody said it except for you, you're a liar. I was with the minyans there and nobody said that
Vaad HaHatzolah who worked to save Torah scholars organized the rally by 400 orhodox rabbis , the Das Torah, in 1943. According to you they were involved with kfeira
To Alexander Moshe
You are a blithering fool. Only a guy like you would go to a rally that supports the majority of the Jewish people who live in Israel and look at "cleavage of a woman."
All the women on stage were actually dressed tzneesdik but that is not the point. 99.9% of the attendees were not looking at how they looked only perverts like you look at a woman and undress her in your mind, a pervert like you should "takke" stay home.
You quote from the JTA about the " Union of Orthodox Rabbis of the United States and Canada " One of the heads of this organization was Rav Moshe Feinstein who actually went to the rally on Shabbos in Washington DC during WW2, so much for your proof. And history has proven that their refusal to attend Soviet Rallies was wrong and actually detrimental to the cause of Soviet Jewry, in fact, all the refuseniks who were in the Soviet Prisons said after they were freed that what freed them was the constant pressure of the protests, but the good rabbis sitting in their warm homes with their families were against it!
The rest of your gibberish is just irrelevant stories that have no connection to what we are talking about.
Rabbi Wein is a respected historian and has more understanding of history than the average Rosh Yeshiva. When a person is sick you go to a doctor and daven you don't go to your Rosh Yeshiva.
I'm the one who said I was at the minyans, and then the rally. There was no cleavage, only you see cleavage. Youre lying again
So how come some of the lithuanian rabbis wives wore no hair covering
I have to laugh at this guy calling himself "Alexander Moshe"
A "Ben Torah" talking about "cleavage"
Tell me does your wife know that you made this comment on a blog?
Why don't you show it to her?
I wonder if she knows that her husband thinks about cleavage when he walks on the streets.
Just wondering was there a Protestant pastor in the roster of speakers. Is he also a sign of achdus . Do we really believe he cares about the Jewish people. Does he believe that we don’t deserve punishment for refusing his deity and the show of love and concern is only a tool to have us convert so the second coming will happen. Is that achdus Zionist pride or maybe they are playing us for idiots. Just wondering who that has a bit of Jewish pride would have an evangelical pastor speak just wondering . When Harav Herzog had to go to the pope that the only pious think about him was his name the first thing he did was to be driven to a Mikve and here a pastor is a speaker just wondering. Do I have to agree with this because of achdus or am I allow to question it and no I will not go to much Jewish blood was spilled and can’t be white washed by his kind words that although very beautiful but are no better then Biloms brocho . Just wondering
4:17
I have absolutely no problem with a Pastor speaking, we need all the friends we can get.
By you asking "Is he also a sign of achdus" shows us all that you don't get it and have no sense of history! I don't care what he believes, and I don't even care that he came to convert us, which is a stupid ignorant comment,BTW! ("He came to convert us?' How silly and childish" who was he converting? The Yeshiva boys?)
Yes the achdus is also "Zionist pride" because when you commit tax fraud, guess where you are going to run? Zionists have what to be proud of as they built a beautiful country that houses the majority of the Jewish people, and whose assimilation rate is less than 2% as opposed to Chutz Le'aaretz which is running at 85%
We don't care if you agree that a pastor is "achdus" we want to know "where the hell were you?"
And you don't have to agree with anything I post, you probably are on the same page as Al Jazeera...
Hamas BTW doesn't care if you are Yeshivash from Lakewood or if you have a Shreimel that reaches the ceiling or if you are a Zionist Rightist or a Zionist Leftists they will rape your daughters and wives just the same , ..think about that
Very intelligent argument Mr Voz is just insult and dismiss . Only you have a sense of history only you understand everything and Carrie’s the torch . 2000 years in exile waiting for a state and we still need to beg please Christian’s like us and defend us more like the 51 st State of the US then a proud country. All the help we need ???. By the way what does it have to do with tax evasion strong bias there . You color everyone with the same paint brush. Very intelligent . I thought you were an intelligent individual that could argue in a civilized way or do I need to be reform or from a different religion to get that respect.
Just wondering
Did you agree to join my fast and yom tefilla???
I don't understand why everyone is obligated to follow your idea that a rally is what we need to do. And if I don't agree I am wrong.
Who made up that a rally is important??? Just because you feel it is???
I don't get it.
4:17
Dumb childish yeshivishe excuses, "cleavage" "the pastor" "reform rabbi" "lesbian" etc etc
WE DON'T CARE!" if you guys would have shown up 100,000 strong you could have changed the narrative but as Rabbi Wein says "you don't care" You guys think that they will not come after your wives and daughters, you guys believe that won't chop the heads off your babies. You guys better wake up soon because they are coming after the frummies first as they are recognizable!
5:46
Go back to kindergarten you are a childish little guy who doesn't know your history
NO I will not "fast with you" The Shulchan Aruch is actually against making fasts.
But I have decided to cut your comments ...
as you yourself said "You don't get it"
I don't think that march you mentioned was mixed concert style with christian pastors speaking so don't compare
5:46
Listen tzaddik and listen good.... we actually do compare because the reason given for people not to go was because of the "agenda" and that is what Rabbi Wein addressed and no one except YOU said anything about mixed crowd. Rav Aron Kotler and his son Shnier attended the Lakewood dinners that were all mixed and not only mixed but they sat next to women, not their own wives and ate. Agudah dinners were mixed until recently.
As far as Christan pastors are concerned, we really don't care at all, many gedoilei hador would offer Sefer Torah to the Pope, read up on your history and stop blabbering and parroting your naive and out-of-touch rabbis.
As I said before, I know you are the same guy defending the ignorant and the naive as I compared your comments with AI and I will delete your comments. If you have something to say, say it on Al Jazeera
To the meshiginar who keeps bringing me rabbis who were opposed to the march, I suggest you reread my post and listen to Rabbi Wein the historian very carefully.
You now brought me an article by Rabbi Aron Feldman who initially backed the march and then like the coward he is, backed out. I have known Rabbi Feldman for many years, and he is not my rabbi nor should he be anyones, he is an extremist, I recall one of his psaks offhand which was against the Chassidishe Minhag of calling up a Bar-Mitzvah Boy for Mafter on the Shabbos before he is actually 13, this has been the minhag for at least 200 years, he paskend that that is "Poiretz Geder" Mamash a "mechutzaf" where does he the "kalteh Litvak" come off paskining for chassidim! His son-inlaw who is a rabbi in Ramat Beit Shemesh is even a bigger extremist but in a quiet subtle way keeping his anti-everything under his belt.
Stop bringing me rabbis as I won't post them. We have our rabbis that fully supported 100% the march and that is all that counts. Your rabbis as Rabbi Wein said are a bunch of "gutless" clueless guys.
I live in Bayit VGan Jerusalem . The Talmidim are learning all night and also fasting. Rabbi Wein must hear much about fear of Yidden in America. I feel that a protest of a visual nature would havevbeen more meaningful. Could have had a chair placed with a photo of each hostage on it. It is sad for all
the millions of dollars spent to bring the 3000,000 participants. If you count 200$ for expenses and loss of pay you have 60 million $
12:06
First of all you cannot put a price on getting the message out that ALL Jews are backing Israel at this time.
Having said that, your cheshben of $60 million makes absolutely no sense. So according to your cheshben it cost $20,000.00 for each person? An accountant you will never be.
I'm glad that no one took your advice that a" protest of a visual nature would have been more meaningful" I have no clue to what you are talking about. We are dealing where in every place on earth where millions are coming out in protest "no visual nature" but physically coming out against All Jews even those Jews in Bayit V'Gan and you suggest some cockamamie "visual nature" protest. I suggest you go back to learning in fasting and stop surfing the net, you are clueless!
12:06
The "visual nature" protest that you naively suggest was done, where posters of the hostages are being placed all over. It has ZERO effect, in fact, they are being torn down and actually causing more hatred!
we need more protests whatever the cost! We are fighting the Soros' of the world who are paying millions for those pro-Palestinian groups.
BTW the Yeshivishe World is all for protests as they close all the highways and main roads in Yerushalayim every day, protesting against the draft, protesting against cell phones, protesting against the Light Rail. You are one very sick puppy suggesting "visual nature" protests that back Jews in Israel and yet back those protests that make a Chillul Hashem. Shame on You and your perverted ilk!
Hey 12:06
You are a troll you don't live in Israel. No one in Israel would talk like you with your visual nature crap! You live in the USA you are very sick.. DIN take this ass hole off !
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