Sunday, June 11, 2023

The Meraglim .. Rav Avigdar Miller.. Vayoel Moshe


The parsha read in Israel is Parshas Shlach, the parsha of the meraglim. It is therefore no coincidence that the FJJ the Flatbush Jewish Journal, decided to print the following question and answer transcribed from one of the Rabbi Avigdar Tapes. 

*לא נוכל לעלות*

Question: Must one undergo a special spiritual preparation in order to go to Eretz Yisroel? 

Answer: And the answer is, absolutely! 

 Yermiyahu Hanavi said in the name of Hashem, “You came and you defiled My land” (Yermiyahu 2:7). And therefore, it is of the utmost importance that someone should be ready to behave if he wants to go to Eretz Yisroel. He should learn how to conduct himself perfectly al pi hatorah before he goes to Eretz Yisroel. 

And even if he is good here, he must make a resolve to be even better there. There are no two ways about that. It’s Eretz Hakodesh and it’s only for Jews who live b’kedusha. 

Now you’ll ask me, what about the Arabs? 

First of all, the Arabs don’t ask us any questions.  They’re not asking me for my opinion. And second is that an Arab, we consider him just like a bird.  There birds who fly into Eretz Yisroel don’t have to have any kedusha. But the Am Yisroel is a different story. They are pogem, they cause damage. When they do a sin they cause great harm in the world. And therefore it’s of the utmost importance that a Jew, before he goes to Eretz Yisroel, must make up his mind to be there b’kedusha. Even if it’s just for a visit. 

Nobody should go unless he’ll go b’kedusha.  The land of Eretz Yisroel has to have something made to its taste. It’s a land of And the land will vomit out its inhabitants (Achrei Mos 18:25). 

Eretz Yisroel is Finicky. It’s a delicate land and only those people who behave properly can please the land. 

TAPE # 200 (January 1977)

*עלה נעלה*

I feel that this answer from Harav Avigdar Miller must be challenged, as this view has proliferated in the minds of the Flatbush Beards  as "Toras Moshe."

The idea that only "tzaddikim" should make Aliyah, learned from this pasuk, is also the view of the Vayoel Moshe.

But this idea that only "tzaddikim" should make aliyah derived from this pasuk is very dangerous and can lead to heresy, G-d Forbid.

The pasuk in Parshas Achrei Mos 18:25 states:

ולא תקיא הארץ אתכם בטמאכם אתה

"You should not cause the land (Eretz Yisrael) to vomit you out when you defile it" 

The Torah prior to this verse lists a number of prohibitions and abominations and concludes with the above quoted verse.

If Rabbi Miller's and the Vayoel Moshe are correct, then how would they explain the following?

In the year 1012, Jews from Mainz were "vomited out", in 1276 all Jews from Upper Bavaria were "vomited out", In 1182 Philip Augustus "vomited out" Jews from Paris. In France, Jews were "vomited out" in 1254, 1306, 1322, 1359, and in 1394. In 1288 Jews were "vomited out" from Italy, in the year 1290 England "vomited out" all its Jews. In 1294 in Berne, Switzerland all Jews were "vomited out" .In 1360 Hungary "vomited out" its Jews. In 1420 Jews were "vomited out" of Austria, in 1442 Jews were again "vomited out" of Bavaria. In 1492 Jews were "vomited out" of Spain and Sicily. In 1496 Portugal "vomited out" its Jews and in 1499 Nuremberg "vomited out" its Jews. 


I could go on and on, but the most tragic episode in Jewish History was when from 1938- 1945, Germany not only vomited out over 6 million Jews but murdered and gassed them! 

The irony is that in Eretz Yisrael during this the biggest tragedy to have befallen the Jewish people, Jews were relatively safe.

From the above historical facts, it seems that "vomiting out" is not unique to Eretz Yisrael.

It also seems that  Ezra and Nechemia disagreed with Rabbi Avigdar Miller and the VaYoel Moshe 

Let's see who Ezra & Nechemia brought from Bavel to Eretz Yisrael? 

"Tzaddikim"?

Get your popcorn out and take a seat.

The gemarrah in Kiddushin 69a lists 10 types of Jews that made Aliyah with Ezra. Included in this list are bastards, challalim (disqualified kohanim), freed slaves, and men married to shiksas. In fact Ezra (9:1-2) writes the kohanim and the leviim living in Eretz Yisrael were more or less intermarried and Ezra throws in the "askanim" for good measure.  

And even though Ezra convinced the people to divorce their shiksas, intermarriage was still prevalent in the days of Nechemyah  (Nechemyeh 13:3, 23). The returnees had no idea that there was a Torah obligation to make a succa and have a Lullav and an Esrog on Succos. Most were mechalleil Shabbos openly and in fact designated Shabbos as the "Market Day." (ibid 13:15-18) 

Chazal (kiddushin 70a) take this a step further. R' Avuha asserts that they engaged in sodomy and adultery, thus increasing the number of mamzeirim. 

Why did Ezra and Nechemyeh bring such people to Eretz Yisrael?

Would it have not be more prudent to leave these sinners in Chutz Le'aaretz? Were they not concerned that they would be defiling the Land, and the Land would then "spit them out?"

No one denies that the redemption after Bavel led to the building of the Second Bais Hamikdash and that came about from sinful Jews! 

This is why the majority of the Jews including many of the Anshai Knesses Hagedoleh remained in Bavel, refusing to go up with Ezra, they reasoned like the anti-Zionists, that the redemption could not possibly come in such a fashion. 

Ezra cursed those who remained and Chazal (Yoma 9a) sharply criticized them. 

So what about the big elephant in the room, the pasuk in Achrei Mos?

To understand this pasuk is to understand how we judge people.

 Lets see how the grandfather of the Chida translates the word "tzaddik"

The Kabbalist, R' Avraham Azulai, writes in his sefer Chesed LeAvraham  (Ma'ayan 3, Nahar 12) that

 "anyone who lives in Eretz Yisrael is considered a "tzaddik"  even though it does not seem that way. For if he was not a tzaddik. the Land would vomit him out, and since the Land does not in fact vomit out its inhabitants means that they are tzaddikim, even though they are presumed to be wicked."

The Netziv (Shivat Zion sec 2 p.6) writes as follows:

" Ezra the Scribe gathered a few thousand Jews in Bavel, all types of people, great Torah scholars, G-d-fearing individuals and also men who had foreign wives, people who regularly violated the Shabbos, and those who had no Torah knowledge whatsoever. These people worked together and prepared the land for settlement, until it was eventually filled with its children. We, too must awaken to the sound of G-d's desire, which resonates from one end of the earth to the other, wherever our brethren are scattered,,,all types of Jews"

Question: 

Is a Jew who is not a "tzaddik" exempt from the mitzvah of succah?

Well there is a direct correlation between Succah and the mitzva of Yishuv Eretz Yisrael, because these are the only two mitzvas that one performs with his entire "guf" body and that is when he enters either a Succah or Eretz Yisrael. In fact the Vilna Gaon quotes a pasuk in tehillim (76:3) to bolster this idea and connection

"ויהי בשלם סכו ומעונתו בציון"

"Then in Yerushalayim in His Succah and in His dwelling in Zion"

פירוש: 'ויהי בשלם'

The Gra in a play on words explains this verse to refer to the mitzva of  succah and the mitzva of living in Eretz Yisrael , equating them.

 איזוהי מצוה שהיא בשלימות בכל גופו של האדם --סכו....היא מצות סוכה .ומעונותו בציון ...לדור בציון . היא מצות ישיבת א''י 

So let's take Rav Avigdar Miller's and the Vayoel Moshe's logic and extend this to Succah!

Would they now say that someone who is not a tzaddik is exempt from the mitzva of succah? Or let's say a "not-a-tzaddik" guy decides to go into the succah, would he not be mekyeim the mitzvah of succah? Would a guy who doesn't put on tefillin or is a mechaalel Shabbos be be prohibited from entering a succah? 

Is a wicked guy exempt from the mitzvah of Succah? So why is he exempt from mitzvas Yishuv Eretz Yisrael? 

Is a rasha exempt from any mitzvah? How about a guy who doesn't put on tefillin, can he now be  mechalleil shabbos? Is a mechaalleil shabbos exempt from fasting on Yom Kippur? 

I have news for R' Miller and the Vayoel Moshe 

The gemarrah in Kesubois 111 says:

כל הדר בארץ ישראל שרוי בלא עון

The chiloinie in a bar in Tel Aviv who lives in Israel may actually be a great tzaddik, according to the just quoted gemmarra! 

According to the Pri Megadim, Mishne Berurah and the Kaf Hachayim one is credited for the mitzva of succah (bedeved) even if one has no intention of wanting to be mekaim the mitzvah!

I could go on and on and bring you countless rabbanim who state that anyone living in Eretz Yisrael is considered a "tzaddik" and even the Chazon Ish considered the Zionists "tinok she'nishba" 

With all due respect this is not "Toras Moshe" its "Toras Avigdar" 



13 comments:

Yudel Shain said...

Reb Avigdor Miller, Z" L was (is) correct in his statements; others may not comprehend what he's saying, but that does not change the facts. Mesorah is the ultimate guide by Klal Yisroel, no matter how many good kashas one may have.

Satmar fin der heim said...

Yudel
Rav Avigdar Miller is not infallible, you say that "others may not comprehend what he's saying" are you saying that he was incoherent?
His views about Israel was clouded by his utter hate of the State of Israel. That's why he was the Satmar mascot, they used him as their English-speaking spokesman in the early days when the Satmar could only talk Hungarian and a smattering of Yiddish that only someone speaking bad German would understand. Frum Holocaust survivors hated his guts as he was a Holocaust denier claiming that the vast majority killed as Jews were not halachically Jewish. He also blamed the Holocaust on the victims. He also had a habit of shooting his mouth off and had no problems totally embarrassing and denigrating the guys asking him questions on his famous Sunday Q&A where most of these tapes come from .... but nicely edited!

Frum but normal said...

Satmar fin der heim said...9.28AM

You are spot on agree with you 100%, but it was that filthy swine Yossi Mizrachi yemach shemo, who claimed that only 1 million jews were murdererd and the 5 million were non jews, it wasn't Avigdor Miller

EMAILIM BATORAH said...

והיא לא תצלח


עקבי משיחא


The כהן גדול, ר' צדוק הכהן זצ"ל , one of the greatest Chasidic Masters & בעל מחשבה writes in his ספר צדקת הצדיק,

"When משה רבינו warned the מעפילים not to attempt to forcefully enter ארץ ישראל before the time is right he said to them והיא לא תצלח The word "והיא" implies that this time it won't be successful but there will come a time in the future when they will be successful even though they will enter forcefully and before the time is right."

*Perhaps, according the צדקת הצדיק this is פשט in the Pasuk אַתֶּם֘ תִּֽירְשׁ֣וּ אֶת־אַדְמָתָם֒ When אַתֶּם֘ תִּֽירְשׁ֣וּ you will posses the land on your own, then וַֽאֲנִ֞י אֶתְּנֶ֤נָּה לָכֶם֙ I will give it to you. אמבצי

*see חזקוני


Anonymous said...

@emailim batorah...yes and rav tzadok also holds that the chait of the meraglim is that they had a sort of kefirah because they didn't believe in themselves.
see this clip from rabbi herzl hefter. eat fruit but throw away the peel from his lecture because he is a somewhat open orthodox rabbi (as he is speaking at a "orthodox women's ordination ceremony"), but his point is correct...he brings this rav tzadok to explain why yidden don't go to eretz yisrael.

https://youtu.be/889U1VupQtg?t=96

Anonymous said...

Only somewhat?

Anonymous said...

yes somewhat "oo" because rabbi hefter is a serious talmid chachom and morah horaah who was known for his tremendous clarity in the rishonim's derech hapsak when he worked for reb aharon Lichtenstein in gush etzion.

if rabbi hefter makes a move, such as ordinating women, he isn't just another clown rabbi looking for attention in the media, but a serious thought out scholar with years of experience. (unlike some "oo" clown rabbis). therefore one may personally take what he says seriously although they must reject the "oo" parts. the "oo" also have rabbi ysoscher katz, a very serious talmud chachom as well. the point is they are legitimate talmidei chachomim who have what to say...you just have to know what to take and what to reject. (eating the fruit but throwing away the peel, see BT mesechtes chagigah 16b-18a).

that rav tzadok he quotes is a serious piece which is explaining that a lesson we could learn from the chait of the meraglim is that a person has to believe in themselves, not to be meek or cowardly for the wrong reasons, which is a sort of kefirah in the kochos Hashem gives every person. for example as DIN posted, the chait of the meraglim has been linked to certain people who reject going to our land, eretz yisrael...it is quoted here in response to emailim batorah quoting another piece of rav tzadok about going into eretz yisrael.

Anonymous said...

Wrong. Badly.Doesn't fly at all. When people have nefarious agendae it becomes rather easy to buttress it with knowledge .Which is how the evil inclination works.
People like their types who permit the 3 chamuros and chiyuv missos are pieces of trash & it is totally out inappropriate to grant any of their wished for regard whatsoever.
There were Conservatives who wouldn't dare go where they tread!

Open Reformodox
That is what they ought to be/have been called!
They shouldn't have been allowed to snatch even the slightest usage of the term orthodox

Satmar 102 said...

2:05
Very nice comment, but there is only ONE big problem, Ezra and Nechemyeh did not agree with you as DIN notes correctly that they brought the guys with "chiyuv missos and pieces of trash" to Eretz Yisrael to build the Second Bais Ha'mikdash and to re-build the settlements. They succeeded!
History proves you wrong twice, once during the Ezra tekufah and then when the Zionist succeeded to re-build the Land Le'sheim Ulteferes, making the Zionist State the biggest makom Torah in Jewish history!

Anonymous said...

Irrelevant to topic.Red herring.Totally.
What's the catch?

On top of that, you are drinking the Kool aid
They weren't entitled to damage the renewal .Today somehow they are.
Those who tried to help Moav & Amon against Nechemiah (probably considering themselves just as Jewish as the builders) are driven out of our national story.

Cohen Y said...

Anon 2:05,
Very well said

Anonymous said...

@ anynomous 2:05 wrote..."Wrong. Badly.Doesn't fly at all. When people have nefarious agendae it becomes rather easy to buttress it with knowledge .Which is how the evil inclination works."

This is why the mareh makom of mesechtes chagigah is provided. aderaba, that was brought about to show the lesson of acher aka elisha ben avvyua to show what the gemara says "achal tachla vshadya shichla lbra" acher started out as a legitmitate talmid chachum who was then yotzi ltarbus raah...acher was a tanna who soured...and that is the gemara's point; eat the fruit i.e. the original torah which was good, but throw away the peel, the kefirah.

rabbis herzl hefter and ysoscher katz both started out as legitimate and serious talmidei chachomin and morei horahh...one was a centrist mo type and one was a talmid of rav chatzel roth ztzl.

they don't see themselves as having a nefarious agenda...they see themselves as serious people who have moved away from their home ideology/theology for serious reasons...the torah they learnt before they became "oo" is the fruit...and so is their legitimate torah they quote...look up the gemara in meseches chagigah and go through the sugya of acher...ayin shum 16b-18a.

lasty, an orthodox jew is someone who practices and observes shabbos, kashrus, and taharas hamishpacha...hashkafah is hashkafah, whether it's wrong or right...it doesnt make someone frum or frei if they have crum or damaging hashkafah, (although it may make them an obnoxious person and a bad influence).

Anonymous said...

Conservative Rabbis 6 decades ago practiced Shabbos,kashrus,taharas hamishpach, and still it was ruled it forbidden to enter their synagogues & rendered their gittin worthless
The bigger problem has been that the Agudah, etc. leadership nowadays,though they have more clout than back then relatively-both prefer to be stuck in a sort of ivory tower & too wimpy to go officially declare them out completely. Further than or akin to the Conservative Denomination
And what makes them "serious"?Ehh?
ChatGpt or secular
Researchers could do a better job than them
How about Louis Ginsberg or Louis Jacobs.Or they lack suitable conniving religious names?!
Enough with your pathetic attempt at pseudo sleight of hand paean titles!
Come out of the closet admit you are their groupie (or albeit less likely an ignorant gullible fella born yesterday. )
What makes them "serious"?
3 chamuros which are forever the basic pinnacle of judaism precepts which they thoroughly whitewash-or worse, (besides much else)-makes all your skewed back slapping moot !